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Spantou
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:23 am    Post subject: So, it wasn't that dangerous after all. Reply with quote

Followed the handbook and got the stage3 installed, going on to Portage, p 50, amd64. Did the chroot routine and checked for errors in misreading etc. to enter /mnt/gentoo, but;

1. The CLI prompt still shows "livecd / #" and

Using emerge-webrsync (emerge sync did not work);
2. There are reams of error messages; tar: portage/**/** Cannot open, Cannot mkdir etc, No such file or directory,

3. This ends with repeated downloads of checksums and signatures and attempts to get portage tar.bz2.
Repeated attempts at this failed and emerge went back to 20160809 without finding any snapshots.

How do I check where I am in the root structure? Tried everything I know, even Dolphin. Livecd is still in the drive and according to HB p50, I should be inside my own Gentoo Linux environment. Then again I am here on the forum and can receive mail through Claws, so I must still be on the livecd. Updating Portage is optional, but I would like to do that.

Any ideas welcome, thanks.
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DONAHUE
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are correct, you did not get into the chroot.
what does running ls -l /mnt/gentoo | wgetpaste -t or mount | wgetpaste -t produce? post urls wgetpaste returns.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 2:46 pm    Post subject: Did both as listed below. Reply with quote

ls -l /mnt/gentoo | wgetpaste -t gets me this one;

http://bpaste.net/show/394df9a7f503

and mount | wgetpaste -t gets this one

http://bpaste.net/show/329b4c88e76f (two eights)

Thanks much. Will have a look myself to see what I can learn.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

your pastebin for ls -l /mnt/gentoo tells us that the gentoo partitions were not mounted at /mnt/gentoo and that /mnt/gentoo exists but is empty.
your pastebin for mount shows that /dev/sdb1 was automounted:
Quote:
/dev/sdb1 on /run/media/gentoo/NovoGate type fuseblk (rw,nosuid,nodev,relatime,user_id=0,group_id=0,allow_other,blksize=4096,uhelper=udisks2)
What is Novogate?
What install media are you using? Neither the sysresccd/usb nor the gentoo minimal install cd/usb should automount.
you can try:
Code:
 umount /dev/sdb1
and then mounting the gentoo partitions at /mnt/gentoo and then try chrooting again.
Recommend using sysresccd if not in use currently.
What type of disk is /dev/sdb?
Code:
fdisk -l | wgetpaste
and post url.
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Spantou
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 7:08 pm    Post subject: Remember a few things now. Reply with quote

Main reason for using Dolphin is the No such file or directory diagnostic when in bash. parted's print reports partitions exactly as in the HB. Partitions are mounted correctly, but I did not have a /mnt partition. Made one and then did mkdir /mnt to do mount /dev/sda3 /mnt, but the file exists already. On the other hand I cannot see it in Dolphin while all the other partitions are there.

These are HDD partitions/directories since I can open Claws' Welcome message in the /home directory.

Retried chroot /mnt/gentoo /bin/bash and got Failed to run command '/bin/bash'. NSFOD.
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DONAHUE
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What install media are you using?
It appears you are attempting to install from a running linux system that has a KDE GUI running installed on /dev/sda. Is this correct? If correct what linux is it?

Quote:
Partitions are mounted correctly, but I did not have a /mnt partition.
Is a self contradictory statement. The handbook expects the root partition to be mounted at /mnt/gentoo. If the /mnt does not exist in the linux system you are installing from you do need to create it as root user:
Code:
mkdir -p /mnt/gentoo
if /mnt exists but /mnt/gentoo does not
Code:
mkdir -p /mnt/gentoo
then
Code:
 umount /dev/sdb
umount /dev/sdb1
umount /dev/sdb2
umount /dev/sdb3
umount /dev/sdb4
mount /dev/sdb4 /mnt/gentoo
mkdir /mnt/gentoo/boot
mount /dev/sdb2 /mnt/gentoo/boot
cd /mnt/gentoo
ls -l | wgetpaste -t
mount | wgetpaste -t
the umount commands may complain that there is nothing to unmount; not a problem. post the urls returned so we can all evaluate readiness for entering chroot.
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Spantou
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:32 pm    Post subject: My last post was out of sequence. Reply with quote

Got work to do.

Novogate is an external 1TB Seagate hard drive used with my Lenovo laptop. Acergate is the other one connected to my partner's Acer. Easy ID's for maintenance.
I used the x86_amd64 multilib disc since the Minimal cd ISO refused point blank to boot further than the first ISOLINUX 3.85 line on the screen. Simply blinked on several occasions for more than five minutes. Booting on BIOS. UEFI, Secure boot OFF still does not see the internal Cdrom to boot.

Ah! I must've misunderstood the HB since I mounted the . . . no, I did it exactly as in the HB . . . then again I did! mount them in sda3 which is my / partition. But as I said, I did not mkpart /mnt. Big mistake! OK, so it's back to square one again. Strip and redo. Easiest, but will let you know what I find before the slash and burn. Have the SysrescueCD ISO'd , but not yet used it. Will try the others ideas to see what I get. OK, this is work, but, yes! getting to grips with it. Ta!
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DONAHUE
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

do please use the system rescue cd, it makes life much easier. You can boot it to a nice xfce4 GUI and have the handbook in the midori browser for ready reference next to the working terminal. Cut and paste the commands. sysresccd will come with /mnt/gentoo on board already.

You said
Code:
mount them in sda3 which is my / partition.
sda3 was the / in the 2/3 years ago handbook. sda4 is / in the current handbook. You do not need the grub_bios partition if the install disk is MSDOS labeled.
Code:
old style:      new style:
none  grub_bios  sda1
sda1  boot          sda2
sda2  swap         sda3
sda3  root           sda4

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 7:52 am    Post subject: Interesting, veery interesting. Reply with quote

Donahue,

Correct, my statements on partitions are contradictory. I am using the Gentoo livecd-amd64-multilib- 20160704.iso from the Gentoo site. Yes, the GUI is KDE Plasma. The paste bin number for fdisk -l |wget paste is 802cf8e99399. I got that listing even before Windows was stripped completely. Plus other info led me to believe that /dev/sda is the internal HDD. I just do not yet know how see what is actually on that disc physically, but I'll get there.

As I know my rig, it has the ISO in the internal disc drive. Windows is over-written and re-partitioned, stage3 tarball downloaded (and installed? not checked) as per HB. Novogate and sdb1 (seen it, duh?) auto-installed both surprises.

I'm just very leery of doing damage due to negligent finger trouble, cost me a hard disc or two already. Will use the RescueCd (some bad ones there too) and unplug the Seagate.

Would love to answer you on points, but you've given me a lot to work on. Intentionally or not, you've given me loads of tips on diagnostics. In the Gentoo tradition I will just have to get down to it, helping myself. It will take a bit of time, but I will keep you in the loop.

Thanks, this is great.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

a brand new fdisk -l or parted -l with any removable flash drives, camera cards, hard drives, etc, removed should help greatly in determining what partitions are where and if more partitioning is needed. pastebin or post the results if you wish comments from the peanut gallery.
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Spantou
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:19 pm    Post subject: I'm falling around too much. Reply with quote

The problem does not lie with what I can see on disc or otherwise. The Seagate issue was incidental and confusing - unnecessarily. Classic case of spring picnic.

Once I wrote out the sequences in the process of booting up, things became clear. Redid the lot. Now just to get the mounting statements down pat according to requirements. Back to the Handbook. Old lesson. Computers are just very quick idiots, they do what you tell them, not what you mean them to do. Ta.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Enough of Windows, don't want to lose PC on Gentoo insta Reply with quote

Spantou wrote:
OK, I know enough on MBR's, partitioning, dual boots and so on, I think. Forgotten quite a lot too. Downloaded Gentoo i686, ISO'd it, disabled UEFI, CD first and it boots perfectly. Busy reading Sven Vermeulen's very good Linux-sea.pdf. Now for the real permanent install. The Lenovo G580, i3 2328M has 4Gig RAM installed, 1TB HDD. So, according to answers to bargava's question elsewhere here, the laptop can handle it.


i love uefi. the long way around. some people put their kernel on efi partition and then wonder why the system has a weird configuration. truth be told, the handbook is wrong. in my opinion is written as if the system will be a mbr/gpt hybrid. which is the worst possible start point. I recently installed centos, fedora, debian, ubuntu in kvm/qemu. with and without edk-ovmf uefi fw. worst possible thing is a hybrid system that has to be both mbr and gpt.

u need to make a simple decision. u either treat your system as a fill 64 bit system and embrace your uefi bios, OR, u hide behind mbr as an old thing of the past.

the trick is the "bios". the firmware. U can't install an uefi OS if you dont boot in an uefi mode. that's the first thing that gets people. regardless of os. my system has all 3 major os's. linux, windows and osx. all 3 in uefi mode. so first trick is to figure out how to boot your system in uefi mode.

which includes, how to write a boot media (usually an usb stick these days). get that iso, make sure that iso HAS uefi mode, then convincing your bios/fw to boot a media in uefi mode, not legacy mode. my bios/fw is set to uefi mode. not legacy mode. several settings. but all matter.

second, booting. press f12 (most bioses/fws) and when you have a usb stick that is capable of both uefi/legacy mode it lists as 2 entries. one uefi device blah blah, one device blah blah. it's important to boot the UEFI one. u can't have gpt/uefi if you dont boot in uefi mode.

gentoo minimal iso is not uefi ready. so using that, you will never be able to bring up a uefi sistem. i assume that's why the handbook is wrong suggestion in that abomination hu

Quote:
Question 1. Are the files sizes for the online installation of the same order? My Internet bandwidth is not the most inexpensive and I would not like to start over in the middle of things. My monthly package is 4GB and I would like to top up or resize before I install Gentoo.



you could install a router/proxy to limit usage of bandwidth. an old computer. we did that back in the 90s. i had like 10+ servers that would all download the same file. and it would have been nice if i would only download once, and share that. today i use a nfs4 mount for /usr/portage/distfiles. plus a semi-complicated web proxy. but the point is, one machine... one storage. just dont delete /usr/portage/distfiles. and do emerge --sync as little as possible.

Quote:
Question 2. How would the install affect my laptop? The G580 has Windows8_OS on drive C: and Lenovo One Key Recovery on drive D:, both on the same hard drive, obviously partitions. The decisions are made, but I need to get into a working environment with as few issues as possible. The fact that I will have to do the Sysadmin type of stuff is exactly the reason I am making the change.


again, be the sysadmin. take control of your system.

which means, you need to backup everything you have on that laptop, and start over. u need to get yourself to a position where loosing all the data on the laptop is not a problem.

u need a few usb bootable sticks. like windows (prolly) and a linux uefi stick (i used ubuntu). and really start over.

this time, dont use fdisk. use gdisk. partition 1. 100 megs. type ef00. vfat. partition 2. type 8300. 100 megs. boot, xfs. partition 3. whatever size. type 8300 which is root. cryptfs bla bla. i dont want to confuse u. if you dont use luksfs or lvm u dont need an extra boot partition. after that type af00 for windows.

Code:

[root@bugiana:~]# gdisk /dev/nvme0n1
GPT fdisk (gdisk) version 1.0.1

Partition table scan:
  MBR: protective
  BSD: not present
  APM: not present
  GPT: present

Found valid GPT with protective MBR; using GPT.

Command (? for help): p
Disk /dev/nvme0n1: 781422768 sectors, 372.6 GiB
Logical sector size: 512 bytes
Disk identifier (GUID): 9EF90B95-7D73-4CF4-9A6A-46D95ABA9DA4
Partition table holds up to 128 entries
First usable sector is 34, last usable sector is 781422734
Partitions will be aligned on 2048-sector boundaries
Total free space is 2157 sectors (1.1 MiB)

Number  Start (sector)    End (sector)  Size       Code  Name
   1            2048          206847   100.0 MiB   EF00  efi
   2          206848       105064447   50.0 GiB    8300  gentoo
   3       105064448       209922047   50.0 GiB    AF00  osx
   4       209922048       781422591   272.5 GiB   0700  7even


when you boot a system in efi mode, it only looks for the gpt signature, and the ef00 partition. the efi partion. u need to have that. no mascarading like the handbook with intermediary solutions. u're either mbr or gpt. and gpt requires THIS simple approach.

again, if you have a setup with lvm/cryptfs/dmraid/mdraid u need another partition for boot. the efi partition if vfat. the boot partition is linuxfs. any linux fs.

Quote:
Will the Gentoo minimal disc install overwrite the D: drive? I know how partitioning works. The MBR is still some mystery - approached with caution. Preferably I would like to take Windows off the PC completely, but I do not want to destroy things by my own stupidity. Mainly I would like to be able to start over again in case of mistakes.

Caveat. I understand nobody here can guarantee fail safety.

Any pointers will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.



over the years i spoke about partitions in various setups. my favorite one is thinking of partitions like putting wallpaper in a room. u have this room with 4 walls. and you have 1 wall to use the red wallpaper, 1 wall to use the green wallpaper, and 2 walls to use the blue wallpaper.


that's a harddrive. with 3 partitions. 1 quarter for linux. 1 quarter for osx. and 1 half for windows. phat os :)

the old way of doing things was to write grub in MBR that was capable to boot all 3.

the new way, uefi, grub is just an extra layer. because that primary 1 partition type efi has bootloaders for all types of OS'es.

a proper setup system, when you press F12 at boot time, offers you the choice to boot natively 64 bits uefi in any os. u dont need grub to boot windows. u ask bios/FW to boot windows. just because you have that perfectly setup EFI partition.

but it has to be ef00. also dont use fdisk. that's a mbr tool. use gdisk, which is a gpt tool.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:02 pm    Post subject: Thanks, this is worth a lot. Reply with quote

Haven't read it all, too excited. Got the mounts right! Ta! Great! That explains why my minimal cd wouldn't boot past the first ISOLINUX line.

Just being ornery didn't answer Donahue's last post, wanted to suss the workings correctly, but thanks Don, the paste bin is at e63449da15a2.

axl,
Read a lot in the last month and got a raft of links on UEFI and GRUB, but the laptop is between OS's so it's difficult to get everything together. It may be worthwhile to google these. Dedoimedo, Adam Williamson at happyasssassin, linuxfoundation - how to make secureboot work with open platforms. All said and done, we're not shot of BIOS/MBR. Fly in the ointment since it can trash your lovely UEFI system. Oh yes, then there is the UEFI consortium (development) and look at (Owner) Intel's site as well.

Me? I'm convinced of UEFI. The one I like most is that you can put /home on its own partition against system crashes. But, early days for me still, so I'll have to pick up tabs as I go.

Edit.
And again as I have it, UEFI won't work if the first partition is not formatted in FAT32. Also, just before this post I wanted to do mount /dev/sda2 /mnt/gentoo/boot, but no go. Reformatted to ext3 on a hunch and both mkdir and mount worked! So yeah, I agree the handbook is slightly difficult to understand here. Maybe a thorough discussion of this would be a good preamble for noobs. Also, right now I do not want to be too clever and cause my own grief.
End edit
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 12:36 am    Post subject: Re: Thanks, this is worth a lot. Reply with quote

Spantou wrote:
Edit.
And again as I have it, UEFI won't work if the first partition is not formatted in FAT32. Also, just before this post I wanted to do mount /dev/sda2 /mnt/gentoo/boot, but no go. Reformatted to ext3 on a hunch and both mkdir and mount worked! So yeah, I agree the handbook is slightly difficult to understand here. Maybe a thorough discussion of this would be a good preamble for noobs. Also, right now I do not want to be too clever and cause my own grief.
End edit



i am more worried you still don't understand which tools to use for which type of partition table. fdisk only works with mbr. gdisk works with gpt. it's important for the disk to have proper partions handled by proper tools. dont use anything other then gdisk. ofc it's just my word against others people word. but from my experience, gdisk does that job. across any os. what gdisk does, works with linux, windows and mac os. the right type of partition.

go again, once u have your EF00 partition:

Number Start (sector) End (sector) Size Code Name
1 2048 206847 100.0 MiB EF00 efi
2 206848 781422734 372.5 GiB 8300 bugiana


u're set efi wise. next thing u have to boot efi. and grub will do the rest.

[root@bugiana:~]# grub-install
Installing for x86_64-efi platform.
Installation finished. No error reported.

no parameters at all. tight config files.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 3:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just tried fdisk on my gpt drive and it works.

Fdisk recently added support for gpt, which appears to be a last-ditch effort to avoid irrelevance IMO.

In my opinion, gdisk is the best partitioning software.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 12:28 pm    Post subject: Thanks, I think I'm past the worst worries. Reply with quote

Yes, I knew about those differences, but then used parted out of curiosity and fired up gparted, using a mix of the two. So, I just passed by that issue. The crunch was I did not know EFI and /boot is the same partition. I've seen many different things on the net about this. Must've been carried away by the technicalities. The tarball is installed now and I'm busy with Portage.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 3:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Thanks, I think I'm past the worst worries. Reply with quote

Spantou wrote:
Yes, I knew about those differences, but then used parted out of curiosity and fired up gparted, using a mix of the two. So, I just passed by that issue. The crunch was I did not know EFI and /boot is the same partition. I've seen many different things on the net about this. Must've been carried away by the technicalities. The tarball is installed now and I'm busy with Portage.



  1. Normally /boot and EFI are different partitions.
  2. In my case they are not, and since my setup works that means they need not be different.
  3. I think that parted/gparted is the most unnecessarily complicated piece of partitioning software on the planet. I have no idea why distribution maintainers use it.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2016 2:27 pm    Post subject: Well, I'm nowhere near your level of Gentoo yet. Reply with quote

I simply know too little to argue the tosses here, went to what seem to be the experts to get started. I see there are many takes on what GRUB, UEFI and the like are or not. All following own experiences and expertise. As I see it, it still is the 32-bit word architecture and the compatibility issues that dictate the confusion. I always find some sanity in getting the low down on anything technical.

Here are a few links that summarize my current knowledge on this. Got quite a few pleasant - and surprising - wake up calls. I give it as I found it while I do not know what you know. Please accept without prejudice. I have no affiliations or connections anywhere.

Redhat Guru, Adam Williamson
https://www.happyassassin.net/2014/01/25/uefi-boot-how-does-that-actually-work-then/

Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Extensible_Firmware_Interface

StackExchange
http://superuser.com/questions/764799/how-to-create-an-efi-system-partition

Linux.com (PDF at bottom of page)
https://www.linux.com/publications/making-uefi-secure-boot-work-open-platforms

Dedoimedo (quite a lot of sense here).
http://www.dedoimedo.com/computer_software.html (archives at bottom)
and mainly GRUB
http://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/grub-2.html

The beauty of Linux is the freedom, of which Gentoo seems to be the best, based on choice as it is.

Better to work from zero base, deal with things as I find it. Choosing battles is impossible.
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