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LegionOfHell
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 3:04 am    Post subject: What kind of SSD should I buy for Gentoo? Reply with quote

I want to install Gentoo on a laptop with a 4-cores Pentium N3540,

I want my system to be very light so I am planning to turn unwanted kernel components off and install dwm with very light software ...

Knowing that Gentoo compiles packages from source and need fast storage, I am in search of an SSD, preferably a 128 GB one, to install Gentoo on it...

My storage interface is SATA3(2.5").


Will any 128GB SSD do or should I look at the fastest ones like Samsung EVO or PRO ?



Many Thanks
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LegionOfHell,

Welcome to Gentoo.

Your SSD read/write speed will be limited by the SATA3 interface.
That's about the same as a single lane PCIe slot. Current SSDs use an M2 slot that provides four PCIe lanes.

Any SSD will be fine. The big speed improvements in moving to SSD come from eliminating the latency waiting for the heads to move to the right track to read the data, then waiting for the platter to rotate to bring the data under the head. You will still get all those benefits.

Don't pay extra for a really fast drive with a SATA3 interface. It will always be limited by the SATA3 interface.
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Proinsias
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been using an 840 Evo 120G since ~2013, it works fine and still seems to have plently life left in it but the three bit technology may wear a little faster than the MLC 2-bit tech.
https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-8307288.html#8307288

Portage on tmpfs may also be of interest.
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Portage_TMPDIR_on_tmpfs
Speed things up and reduce diskwear by compiling in ram
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Proinsias,

Proinsias wrote:
Speed things up and reduce diskwear by compiling in ram

That's only partly true.
If you have the RAM to have /var/tmp/portage is tmpfs, the kernel will keep everything cached anyway, so the speed improvement is too small to measure.
It certainly reduces disk wear by preventing writes that will never be read.
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NeddySeagoon

Computer users fall into two groups:-
those that do backups
those that have never had a hard drive fail.
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Tony0945
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm no expert for sure. However, I have two systems with Crucial MX500 SSD's and they are working fine. I picked them because they are a company with a solid reputation for reliability and the SSD's have a five year warranty. No, they are not the fastest, but they aren't slow either.
You can google for technical comparisons between Crucial and Samsung. I have seen lots of complaints about both companies data migration software, but for Gentoo, it seems more trouble than using "cp -a" or rsync. I'm not even sure that the software works on Linux.

I have over 16,000 hours on the central server which runs pretty much continually with (mostly) weekly portage updates.

For the "stick of gum" style, I would buy Samsung for performance but for 2.5 inch SATA, I'm well pleased with Crucial. Samsung does benchmark slightly faster but both are 3 to 4 times faster than even 10,000 RPM hard drives. When the 1TB models get a little cheaper I'll be putting one of those in a third system that dual boots and run Windoze in a virtual machine instead of dual booting. I'm already running the two applications that have no Linux versions (TurboTax and MsMoney) in virtual machiones on one of the SSD machines (the newer one, non server) and it's definitely the way to go instead of clunky dual booting. Windoze comes up much faster as a virtual on SSD than as a dual boot on HDD and you can switch instantly back and forth and cut and paste between them.

Again, I'm no expert, just a fellow user.

EDIT: The sweet spot seems to be at 500GB in terms of price per GB. I did buy a TeamElite 128 for $20 on Black Friday but haven't used it yet. I have no experience with their products. Just had to buy it for the price of a restaurant dinner, but am leery of quality on something so cheap. My two Cricials are 250 and 500, almost the same price bought 18 months apart. As the PCI versions gain in popularity, the SATA drives are dropping in price., pushing the HDD's even cheaper. I (and I suspect most people) only consider HDD today for large bulk storage, 4TB and up.
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axl
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I hear this question: "What type of ssd?" I immediately hope it is not followed by the word SATA. Sata is a bad slow interface. A thing of the past, AT LEAST FOR root fs. Sata CAN still be faster than network speed. IF your SATA can read stuff with 100 MBps and can satisfy a 1000 Gbps line then u're prolly fine. For network storage. It's fine.

But for your own computer, nvme drives and pci express drives are expensive. I will concede that. And its sometimes impossible to install into laptops if the laptop doesn't have an m2 connector. Or a desktop if it's old. Maybe you don't have enough lanes. Whatever. This stuff is pretentious let's say. But it's so smooth. I bought 3 years ago now, 3 intel 750 series drives. They connect directly into the pci express bus. They are hard drives, on a pci board... how cool is that? Well, if you motherboard supports that sort of stuff. And in my case if you have a desktop. They did make a model for laptops. since then, they have been popping up everywhere and everyone seems to be taking notice and using them. More and more of the laptops that I see now have implicit or as an option a nvme drive.

All in all, a sata drive has a theoretical maximal peak of 600MBps. My 3 year old intel 750 does routinely 2200MBps. and it's not theoretical. This thing is not only fast. it's comfortable reading and writing at the same time, with multiple threads. and keeps that performance as you increase number of threads (users). a nvme drive just keeps on going. and since it's not related to the now infamous "south-bridge" it doesn't share interrupts with other components. the computer doesn't begin to lag. mouse doesn't jerk. sound doesn't crackle. No baby, nvme drives connect directly into the north bridge components. with cpu, memory, and gpu. on the high bus baby.

There's a general feeling of HIGH responsiveness that you get from a nvme drive that you can't get from any sata. ssd or otherwise. SATA is just bad. Personally I wouldn't buy any SATA drive unless it's for the express purpose of network storage.
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Tony0945
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 3:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

axl wrote:
When I hear this question: "What type of ssd?" I immediately hope it is not followed by the word SATA. Sata is a bad slow interface. A thing of the past, AT LEAST FOR root fs.

as you say later in the post, not every motherboard supports M2 and I see M2 SATA drives advertised. But every motherboard except extremely old IDE mobos support SATA and they are a drop in for laptops. Going from 80-100 Mbps to 400-480 is not a minor upgrade.
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axl
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 3:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony0945 wrote:
axl wrote:
When I hear this question: "What type of ssd?" I immediately hope it is not followed by the word SATA. Sata is a bad slow interface. A thing of the past, AT LEAST FOR root fs.

as you say later in the post, not every motherboard supports M2 and I see M2 SATA drives advertised. But every motherboard except extremely old IDE mobos support SATA and they are a drop in for laptops. Going from 80-100 Mbps to 400-480 is not a minor upgrade.


I know. I agree. I'm just saying ... at least try to look forward. At least make a plan for next year. I think it's an upgrade worth having. my 2 cents.
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szatox
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Going from 80-100 Mbps to 400-480 is not a minor upgrade.
More importantly: seek times. And even more important in case of laptops: shock resistance.
In case of a desktop I still consider 7200 rpm HDD fast enough, since your disk buffers in RAM hide subsequent reads from you anyway.

Quote:
I am in search of an SSD, preferably a 128 GB one
If it's your primary machine, I suppose you're going to run out of space in no time.
If it's just a key chain device, take something cheap :)
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harrymnd
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure if this can be applied to laptop not an expert though since I'm new and still learning about gentoo, but I'm using a samsung 970 SSD M.2 which runs fast on my machine (desktop / i7 8700k, 16gb ram), I haven't tried to use a SATA but base on my research it's an ideal to use a SSD now a days specially if you need a fast response(read / write), on my end my goal is to build a server on my house which will have different connected devices on it (cctv, iot, etc) haven't finished it yet though but yeah it's good to have an SSD I found it fast when I compare it to my old desktop that use a Hard Disk (SATA).
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