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russianpirate
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:07 pm    Post subject: Gnome vs KDE take 10 Reply with quote

Mod edit: Split off from https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-345234.html --kallamej

[flame]stay with gnome.. kde sucks

kde's programs (arts, kontrol center, im messenger, audio player, and everything else except k3b) is worse than a GTK app (on gnome).. if ur gonna use most KDE apps, then swithch, but the desktop itself in KDE is worse than gentoo
[/flame]

^^ all my opinion

sry for flame
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sneakyme66
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

explain more please, I'm interested why you think so?
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Epyon
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

russianpirate wrote:
[flame]stay with gnome.. kde sucks


[flame]IMHO gnome sucks. Its buggy and incomplete (2.10 shipped without the ability to edit the applications menu). I've been far less pissed at my computer since switching to kde. Stuff generally works well. Also, Konqueror > nautilus.[/flame]

If you want to switch over with as little hassle as possible, just put kde and qt in your use flags and then emerge kde. Then emerge --newuse world.
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sneakyme66
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah, I've been seeing that buggy side lately. And the main reason I was looking to switch is because the apps that work best for me are the kde apps... i mean what can you say despite the few excelent gnome apps it has a long way to go still. I can't say that I haven't been happy with it in the past, it's taught me alot.
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DrZoidberg
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used to swear by KDE from about 1999-2004, but KDE is just out of control in terms of bloat and junk. Konqueror has never been such a great browser for me. Nowhere close to mozilla/firefox. The panel/control center UI is just confusing and wierd. The multimedia stuff has always been in significantly broken in some way or other. (kaffeine video player crashes, konqueror's tag editor freezes, noatun skips, arts.....)

Up until the last few years, GNOME was just horrible-- it seemed to be a confusing, haphazard mess of software that just couldn't decide how to work together. Early mozilla was unusable. Enlightenment looked cool but never really fit in well with other apps. But nautilus really works well without being as heavy as konqueror. I switched to GNOME around 2.6, after getting annoyed with KDE 3.3.X.It seems like gnome is getting its $hit together and concentrating on making a useful desktop environment. KDE seems to be spinning out of control with a million frivolous applications, at the expense the basics: filemanger, easy UI configuration/customization, and a decent web browser. Granted, the gnome CD burning apps are still way behind k3b.
But you can use k3b w/o having to install too much of the KDE stuff.

I'm still using gnome 2.8, but can't you just right-click menus to edit them?
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Epyon
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use konq as a web browser because its fast and has nice stuff like a built in spell checker. khtml is getting better all the time. There was news today about it passing the acid2 test. The control center has a lot of stuff in it but I don't really see that as a bad thing. I like being able to customize everything.

Ever since gnome 2.4, nautilus has never seemed right to me. Could have been the buggy mime type detection or, in later versions, the spatial stuff. I hate it how it warns me every time I double click a wmv file that it thinks is a incorrectly named asf file. That got annoying real fast. Konq loads fast for me and does what I tell it to.

In Gnome 2.10 they didn't have time to include the ability to edit the menu through a gui. No more right click menu or going to applications:// in nautilus.
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sneakyme66
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sounds like for now, i may leave gnome just to see how i like kde first
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superstoned
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i agree KDE has an overload of options, but i like its flexibility. and they are working on the huge amount of buttons, kde 3.4 already removed 2 from konqueror, more to come.

there is not much speed difference between gnome and KDE now, they just feel different, but i think KDE 4 will change that dramatically. QT4 will be using much more hardware acceleration from X (part of which they are implementing themselves). but then again, that'll take some time (KDE 4 is said to be ready somewhere in the first half of next year).

but for me, ATM, KDE (SVN) already offers much more than gnome in terms of ease of use (alright, takes a bit more time to get used to, maybe, but there are many little things that make your live easier, which i miss in gnome), features and configurabillity.

so i'd say give it a try.
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stkaplan
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have very little experience with GNOME, besides watching someone play around in a fresh Ubuntu install, but as a KDE user, I find that I've been slowly switching exclusively to KDE. I used to use KDE with a whole bunch of non-KDE programs like Firefox, Thunderbird, OpenOffice, and XMMS, but I've switched to almost exclusively KDE. I'm now using Konqueror, Kontact, and Amarok, and I plan to play around with the new KOffice at some point. I'm still using Gaim over Kopete, though. The problems I saw, especially with Konqueror, mostly involve is heavy configurability. For example, I didn't know until a couple weeks ago that Konqueror had mouse gestures, because the option is hidden away in the Control Panel. However, as a shallow bastard, I love the Plastik theme and the Crystal icon set, and GNOME apps just look pretty dull. (Yes, there is the GTK-QT engine, but it doesn't work well with Java.) People keep talking about the bloat, but everything seems snappy and responsive on my computer.

So basically, I'd say you should try KDE for a while, but it takes a while to get into, since there are so many options you can play around with.
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thechris
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

in short, i'd stick with KDE. its a DE that won't leave you stranded when some gnome dev decides EVERYONE would love to try his new "spatial nautilus" so much they wouldn't even bother looking for a way to revert. of course you could find said option in the app that was "for testing purposes only"... given that KDE can be configured to look like gnome (or XFCE) i'd use it.

kplayer. the mplayer of kde.
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superstoned
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thechris wrote:
in short, i'd stick with KDE. its a DE that won't leave you stranded when some gnome dev decides EVERYONE would love to try his new "spatial nautilus" so much they wouldn't even bother looking for a way to revert. of course you could find said option in the app that was "for testing purposes only"... given that KDE can be configured to look like gnome (or XFCE) i'd use it.

kplayer. the mplayer of kde.


you've got a point. KDE only does major changes in behaviour between major versions (3.0-4.0), gnome can change enormously between point releases.
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Red Nalie
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One word: Integration (in a good way)
One of the main reasons I'll never leave KDE.

Kioslaves, amaroK, Konqueror. It all fits right in, without anything being mandatory.
I 'love' KDE :D
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:04 pm    Post subject: KDE all the way Reply with quote

I too loves KDE...

Apps integrate well together
Konquerer is alot better than most seem to give it credit for
Nice toolkit and dev stuff


But.... (things I hate)
QT seems to be such a waste of desktop real estate (I mean, can I really not reduce the width of the scroll bars?! etc)
No really good gimp style app
arTs - its evil
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codergeek42
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi all.

sneakyme66 just wanted to know how to effectively switch from GNOME to KDE (to try it out or to use it as his* primary DE or for whatever reason he may have had in mind). I don't think this was intended to be a GNOME/KDE discussion thread at all. If you prefer GNOME over KDE (like I do) then use GNOME and don't install KDE stuff. If you prefer KDE over GNOME (like others do) then use KDE and don't install GNOME stuff. It's rather simple. :wink:

Let's keep this thread on-topic please. ^_^


* I apologize if sneakyme66 is a lady. I'm just too lazy to write he/she, his/her, etc. all the time. :oops:
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frodoontop
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why choose? Every once in a while I like to switch desktops. Only problem is that my system really slows down if I have installed kde simultaniously with gnome, so I made different gentoo installs for them.

On boot I have the choice to Gentoo_KDE and Gentoo_GNOME. This way I can choose depending on what mood I'm in. Cause after all, I don't see the reason for all these flamewars. I like both desktops and their apps, however in different ways. I think it's a great strength of Linux, the power to display your desktop in very different ways.

To make it even more convenient to install gentoo twice, use the alternative install method to be found on www.gentoo.org/doc or something like that. Just use the Knoppix method which works perfectly within Gentoo too.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have done the same once sneakyme66 and believe me KDE sucks. I though kde was better when I switched to it but all I have found in kde is bloat and junk I'm reinstalling again just to make a clean gnome gtk system again. BTW, QT interface sucks too is ugly.:wink:
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superstoned
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
I have done the same once sneakyme66 and believe me KDE sucks. I though kde was better when I switched to it but all I have found in kde is bloat and junk I'm reinstalling again just to make a clean gnome gtk system again. BTW, QT interface sucks too is ugly.:wink:


well, then, we seem to disagree :D

I think gnome threads you like you are a total moron, and i don't like that. i guess morons like it...

i prefer the flexibility and freedom KDE gives me.

but i agree about aRts - it sucks. but in KDE 4.0 it'll be replaced by something that'll be for sure much better. just like almost the whole DE :D

the things i've read about the upcoming KDE4 are really amazing! i run kde 3.5 svn now, which is cool, but damn - i want KDE4 :D
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whats great about KDE apps is that they have alot of features, but what ruins it, is that all those features get in the way. I read that they started to work with usability professionals, I realy hope they get things fixed.
It just kills me to watch amarok. Such a great technology and such a horrible interface.
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superstoned
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rapsey wrote:
Whats great about KDE apps is that they have alot of features, but what ruins it, is that all those features get in the way. I read that they started to work with usability professionals, I realy hope they get things fixed.
It just kills me to watch amarok. Such a great technology and such a horrible interface.


well, imho amarok is an example of an app that isn't that bad. it got better in SVN (upcoming amarok 1.3) but its not that bad. most things are done very well. but if you know a way to do things better, just tell'em...

ok, juk is much cleaner, but hey, it has less than half the features amarok has. features DO make an interface more complex, maybe not 1 or 2 of them, but an app that can do 1000x what another can do is doomed to look more difficult. provided both apps are well designed (a poorly designed simple app can look worse than a complex app with a good design, duh)
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i've switched between these two DE about 10 times and can never decide waht to use. this is what i've come to

KDE pro:
looks decent right after installing.
splash screen is better looking
konqueror has better functionality than nautilus
menu editor

GNOME pro:
a little more stable.
gdm is beter than kdm
kde reminds me of windows
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Kensai
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

superstoned wrote:
well, then, we seem to disagree :D

I think gnome threads you like you are a total moron, and i don't like that. i guess morons like it...

i prefer the flexibility and freedom KDE gives me.

but i agree about aRts - it sucks. but in KDE 4.0 it'll be replaced by something that'll be for sure much better. just like almost the whole DE :D

the things i've read about the upcoming KDE4 are really amazing! i run kde 3.5 svn now, which is cool, but damn - i want KDE4 :D

If you want something that isn't for morons then go Fluxbox and XFCE or Enlightenment they are great. Also Gnome is kool since it is not as windows like as kde which is made for true lazy people that want everything in a broken kthis kthat and ksucks app. Bloat and Junk = KDE. Gnome is simple and not as n00b as kde. And GTK interface is beautifull.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rush_ad wrote:

GNOME pro:
a little more stable.
gdm is beter than kdm
kde reminds me of windows

Let me add to it
GNOME pro:
a little more stable. ( I find it more stable not little)
gdm is beter than kdm ( KDM is a pice of trash)
kde reminds me of windows (KDE is windows running on Linux)
-Gtk looks better, qt sucks
-Konqueror is a joke nautilus is simple and clean
-Gnome has never crashed on me using a stable release. Kde crashes in every stable release I've tried and I'm not jocking about this.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kensai wrote:
I have done the same once sneakyme66 and believe me KDE sucks. I though kde was better when I switched to it but all I have found in kde is bloat and junk I'm reinstalling again just to make a clean gnome gtk system again. BTW, QT interface sucks too is ugly.:wink:


Could you please explain in simple terms what "bloat" is and what in KDE qualify as "bloat"? And also why Gnome do not have this socalled "bloat"?
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ebrostig wrote:
Kensai wrote:
I have done the same once sneakyme66 and believe me KDE sucks. I though kde was better when I switched to it but all I have found in kde is bloat and junk I'm reinstalling again just to make a clean gnome gtk system again. BTW, QT interface sucks too is ugly.:wink:


Could you please explain in simple terms what "bloat" is and what in KDE qualify as "bloat"? And also why Gnome do not have this socalled "bloat"?
That's a topic for a different thread. This was originally a support thread, and it would be great if you would keep it as such. Thanks. :)
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

codergeek42 wrote:
ebrostig wrote:
Kensai wrote:
I have done the same once sneakyme66 and believe me KDE sucks. I though kde was better when I switched to it but all I have found in kde is bloat and junk I'm reinstalling again just to make a clean gnome gtk system again. BTW, QT interface sucks too is ugly.:wink:


Could you please explain in simple terms what "bloat" is and what in KDE qualify as "bloat"? And also why Gnome do not have this socalled "bloat"?
That's a topic for a different thread. This was originally a support thread, and it would be great if you would keep it as such. Thanks. :)

No problems, but it pisses me off all the talk about "bloat", but when asked nobody can answer what this "bloat" is. I'm sick and tired of people complaining about "bloat" without even knowing what it is.
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