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vm
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 5:42 pm    Post subject: Why Gentoo is 200% better than MacOSX Reply with quote

Positive side:
0. Emerge. Just emerge.
1. I have my mobile phone as remote control for XMMS audio player. Very comfortable if you have wireless headphones.
2. All applications are been compiled with special CPU instructions support - for example, Quake3 is about 2 times faster than on MacOSX.
3. Sound quality is perfect.
4. Very long battery time (~8 hours with wireless enabled), very flexible configuring for all my needs. (pbbuttonsd makes good work with sleep/hybernation)
5. Distributed computing, connectivity. x86 powerfull host computer for hard applications, PPC laptop as X terminal. (e.g. Skype)
6. Shoutcast is fast. Radio, Video streaming. www.icecast.org + xmms
7. Very fast, very secure and very very stable. Linux inside!

Negative side:
1. No windows codecs.
2. No macromedia flash.(but maybe its positive ?)
3. No Radeon screen rotation support.
4. Java is without "altivec" PowerPC CPU instructions support. (but Kaffe does, emerge kaffe)


And this is just iBook G4.

Share your positive examples, please.
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przeuj
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow! all those things you managed to get working on a notebook (sorry - thats iBook ;) )? impressive - most of the notebooks Ive been using with linux proved to be very hard to convert from windows :( ACPI being first thing you break your teeth on ;)

perhaps I should convert :D
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ruben
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 9:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Why Gentoo is 200% better than MacOSX Reply with quote

vm wrote:
4. Very long battery time (~8 hours with wireless enabled), very flexible configuring for all my needs. (pbbuttonsd makes good work with sleep/hybernation)

The 8 is a typo, right? I've got an iBook G4 and I get at most 4-4.5 hours on battery. And this is running on lowest screen brightness, without wireless, with laptop-mode-tools so the harddisk is spinned down most of the time, and running on 666Mhz instead of 1.3Ghz.
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Cenrim
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm.. I think with minimal harddisk activity 8 hours could be possible

when i send my harddisk into standby mode (hdparm -y /dev/hda && hdparm -C /dev/hda) , the 'current' value in /proc/pmu/battery_0 drops by ca 400
this is with working harddisk and cpu @1.2GHz, full load (revdep-rebuild):
Code:
flags      : 00000011
charge     : 3777
max_charge : 3919
current    : -1231
voltage    : 12182
time rem.  : 11045


current drops to ~1050 when i lower the brightness of the display as much as possible (w/o turning off ;))
activating airport would add ~200
I think CPU and harddisk consume the most of the power.. from somewhere the energy, which heats my hdd up, has to come! ;)
Code:
# smartctl -A /dev/hda | grep Temp
194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       49 (Lifetime Min/Max 16/63)


well, pbbuttonsd's ibam combined with some periodical checks (cpu-freq, harddisk activity, wireless activity) could surely show some intresting stuff ^^
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brazzmonkey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

8 hours, i never thought a laptop could achieve such an uptime using batteries only... that's amazing... to good to be true...

about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*
3-4 i don't know about those ones
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brazzmonkey wrote:
about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*


no, this does not work. this is PPC not x86 :?
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

corsair wrote:
brazzmonkey wrote:
about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*


no, this does not work. this is PPC not x86 :?


wooops, didn't know about that... sorry then... well, one of my plan was to buy a mac laptop one day, but right now i'm not sure i will...
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Cenrim
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

brazzmonkey:
there are rumors, that apple will reveil an iBook/MacBook (w/o Pro) with intel-cpu in the next months, so if the day you are talking about isn't in near future, you'll get a x86-mac laptop ;)
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't care that much about Flash, 3D, or win32codecs, but linux won't be 200% better than OSX until I can suspend my 12" nvidia PB to ram. I don't mind the suspend to disk that much, but it's nice to be able to suspend just by shutting the lid. It's even nicer to be able to wake up without going through the OF and yaboot routine.

8 hrs of battery? I get ~4hrs under OSX and linux with the screen dimmed as much as possible, but with the wireless up and running.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 5:52 am    Post subject: Re: Why Gentoo is 200% better than MacOSX Reply with quote

1. emerge is great. Gotta love the USE flags. Fink doesn't give you control of dependencies.
3. Sound is wonky on my 600 Mhz G3 ibook is Linux too. My PCs sound is fine with Gentoo.
4. Seems I bit to high, anyways my battery is long dead.
5. Never messed with Cross compiling. I've used distcc across x86 machines.

1. New Intel Macs should be well supported just like any other good x86 notebook. Suspend to Ram being notable exception.
2. Flashblock extension for Firefox. Let's you click flash logo, to start flash animation.
3. Ati driver support is very basic. They finally just release driver supporting latest series of chips, including the one MacBook Pro and iMac.

I personally enjoy using OS X mainly for the window management. The decade old taskbar design just doesn't scale well, and I can't wrap my head around virtual desktops.

In OS X, you have so much more control than in KDE, Gnome, or Windows.
Close windows without close app. Command-w.
Close all windows without closing app. Command-Option-w.
Quit an application, which of course closes all windows. Command-q.
Application switching. Command-tab. NOTE" alt-tab for Windows is EVERY OPEN window switching.
Switching windows within an application. Command-~.
Hiding an application. Command-h. Use tinkertool to make hidden app's icon translucent is dock.
Lastly expose. Which has at least one knockoff: kompose.
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Sheri255
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is flash, if you:
emerge mozilla-firefox-bin netscape-flash
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ruben
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@brazzmonkey, @Sheri255...
If you (obviously) do not have experience with running linux on the powerpc architecture, then it's better to not give advice to other people about it. The things you say are not correct, and someone thinking about using linux on powerpc may take your information for truth and then be disappointed afterwards.
So.. win32codecs can not be used and there is no flash support from macromedia.

@Cenrim
I never really looked into those infos from pmud. I mean check the current with or without wireless and so on. But well.. I still don't believe the 8 hours.. Too bad the original author doesn't seem to reply.
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Sheri255
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ruben wrote:
@brazzmonkey, @Sheri255...
If you (obviously) do not have experience with running linux on the powerpc architecture, then it's better to not give advice to other people about it. The things you say are not correct, and someone thinking about using linux on powerpc may take your information for truth and then be disappointed afterwards.
So.. win32codecs can not be used and there is no flash support from macromedia.

@Cenrim
I never really looked into those infos from pmud. I mean check the current with or without wireless and so on. But well.. I still don't believe the 8 hours.. Too bad the original author doesn't seem to reply.

Well, I did like I wrote on my AMD64, and it works fine 8)
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@ruben
well i think i already apologized on my second post in this thread... but of course you're right
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flash is a positive thing for me. Im gonna try and get it emulated with qemu sometime.
I think that a few mac users at my school would ssay no to linux because of this one feature missing.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

corsair wrote:
brazzmonkey wrote:
about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*


no, this does not work. this is PPC not x86 :?


I know that you can still emerge things that aren't *supposed* to be on PPC.
If they work, you should let the devs know. But still, its always worth a shot!
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Omega21 wrote:
corsair wrote:
brazzmonkey wrote:
about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*


no, this does not work. this is PPC not x86 :?


I know that you can still emerge things that aren't *supposed* to be on PPC.
If they work, you should let the devs know. But still, its always worth a shot!


sure thing that things that aren't unmasked on ppc work most of the times if they are source based! but the win32codec package contains windows dlls AFAIK. so this is a definetly 'no-go' on ppc. the binaries are just made for x86 and not for any other architecture. :cry:
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

corsair wrote:
Omega21 wrote:
corsair wrote:
brazzmonkey wrote:
about your negative sides, i should point out that :
1. emerge win32codecs
2. search for packages named *swf*


no, this does not work. this is PPC not x86 :?


I know that you can still emerge things that aren't *supposed* to be on PPC.
If they work, you should let the devs know. But still, its always worth a shot!


sure thing that things that aren't unmasked on ppc work most of the times if they are source based! but the win32codec package contains windows dlls AFAIK. so this is a definetly 'no-go' on ppc. the binaries are just made for x86 and not for any other architecture. :cry:


Ahhhh. I forgot there were dlls involved.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Why Gentoo is 200% better than MacOSX Reply with quote

ruben wrote:
vm wrote:
4. Very long battery time (~8 hours with wireless enabled), very flexible configuring for all my needs. (pbbuttonsd makes good work with sleep/hybernation)

The 8 is a typo, right? I've got an iBook G4 and I get at most 4-4.5 hours on battery. And this is running on lowest screen brightness, without wireless, with laptop-mode-tools so the harddisk is spinned down most of the time, and running on 666Mhz instead of 1.3Ghz.


It sounds like perhaps you have a dying battery. The cells give-up over time and the battery eventually needs replaced.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, the battery is not yet dying... the battery on my former laptop was degrading slowly after 2 years.. but this one is still fine, it's 9 months old now. I also keep the battery in good shape by regularly fully charging and uncharging it.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm really considering dual booting on my powerbook and/or single booting Gentoo on my mac mini. Does Mac-On-Linux run with Tiger?
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, it does
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My 2 cent
Negative side:

1) WPA support is poor
2) pbbuttonsd with powerbook doesn't have a good keyboard autoadjust illumination support (it change countinuos)
3) Special keys (canc key for example) doesn't exist on powerbook keyboard (and change the default keycodes is hard)
4) External monitor output doesn't work
5) Support for broadcom integrated wlan card is incomplete (for example it not start at boot time), and work only in active mode (at this time, only cvs release of kismet permit to sniff packet)
6) Modem and bluetooth doesn't work (or it's hard to get it working)

Positive side:

1) It released under GPL License
2) Great Documentation
3) Great support Forum
4) All source are available
5) TOTAL control of your computer
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@atomik
Maybe you need to mention which model exactly you're talking about. Because I have for example an external monitor working on my iBook G4 with a Radeon 9550. As far as I know, bluetooth is supported, but I don't have firsthand experience. About the special keys... that's a disadvantage on both osx and linux, isn't it? And you could always map a certain key combo with xmodmap... it's not that hard.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2006 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ruben wrote:
@atomik
Maybe you need to mention which model exactly you're talking about. Because I have for example an external monitor working on my iBook G4 with a Radeon 9550. As far as I know, bluetooth is supported, but I don't have firsthand experience. About the special keys... that's a disadvantage on both osx and linux, isn't it? And you could always map a certain key combo with xmodmap... it's not that hard.


My laptop is a Powerbook 15 inch 5,6 (1,67 Ghz)
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