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matze_na
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tuxonice-31 is available in ~amd64.
Since it doesn't change the kernel in a significant way but merely adds some features, it should be as stable as the gentoo-sources of the same version.
So if gentoo-sources-31 are running stable for you, so should tuxonice-31, even though it is still keyworded.
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Moriah
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, but see the laptop thread mentioned above also for some additional concerns.

Since this is a production money making machine (I earn my living as a consultant, and this is my road warrior box), I am hesitant to run non-production code on it.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
would you recommend .33 over .32? i'm currently using gentoo-2.6.32


Only if you are using reiserfs3. They've been messing with the BKL (Big Kernel Lock), which is used in reiserfs. They are making it preempt-able. What that is supposed to mean is that reiserfs3 will become an even better performer. In my tests on this machine, this seems to be the case.

However, on the new web server, the .33 kernel caused a strange problem. It was locked in mid compile, causing all kinds of disk errors on reboot. However, conky, and some of the xfce4 plug-ins were still active and updating the screen.

I am beginning to think that was an abnormality caused by a BIOS that wasn't clocking the chip properly, and possible other issues related to the disk. Since 2.6.33-zen1 has been on this machine, it has worked just fine, and behaved itself as far as not leaving little holes in the file system structure.

To answer your question more directly in light of the above, I would at least consider setting up a .33 kernel and seeing how it works out for you. If it proves to be an improvement over the .32, then use it, by all means.

I'm going to set up a .33 kernel on one of my other machines to see how it works out on a machine left on for more than a few hours a day. That should really tell the tale.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moriah,

Since there's no harm in setting the kernel up for testing, you could keyword unmask the newer versions, and see how they operate for you. On the other hand, this machine still has a .30 kernel for those times that only a known super-stable kernel will do. Since the .30 tuxonice is also stable, I don't see as there will be any harm in using it.

I call it super stable because I don't have to enter strange extra data into any files to keep things running as expected. The .31 kernel forced changes to /etc/exports, and to /etc/lilo.conf or /boot/grub/grub.conf. .32 carries the need for these changes forward. .33 is till too new to really judge properly.

Hope that helps.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
Quote:
would you recommend .33 over .32? i'm currently using gentoo-2.6.32


Only if you are using reiserfs3. They've been messing with the BKL (Big Kernel Lock), which is used in reiserfs. They are making it preempt-able. What that is supposed to mean is that reiserfs3 will become an even better performer. In my tests on this machine, this seems to be the case.



hi pappy:

thanks for answering my question... i do use reiserfs3 on one of my laptops, and i started playing with zen-sources.

currently, i have this:
Linux xxxxxxxx 2.6.32-zen3 #2 ZEN SMP PREEMPT Thu Dec 31 15:19:59 CST 2009 i686 AMD Duron(tm) Processor AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux

This is my first attempt at using zen and your seed on this machine. uptime shows:15:20:36 up 66 days, 22:39, but i've noticed some quirks

so here's the rub...

i ran the dmesg command to check out boot messages and saw something i didn't expect... basically a lot of page allocation failures:
# dmesg |grep -c "page allocation"
69

here's on example

[5548944.261956] cat: page allocation failure. order:2, mode:0x4020
[5548944.261971] Pid: 13271, comm: cat Not tainted 2.6.32-zen3 #2
[5548944.261977] Call Trace:...

see the rest of this particular error here:
http://pastebin.com/xgf309A4

any ideas?

let me know what other info would help troubleshoot and if i should start a different thread for this.

-=g=-
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would be best to start a new thread on this issue. I'm wondering why the error happened so long after initialization.

At this point, it would be best to see if you can replicate the error. If so, write a bug report and see where it goes. I have always felt that the .32 kernels felt broken for some reason. This might be one of those breaks showing itself.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
It would be best to start a new thread on this issue. I'm wondering why the error happened so long after initialization.

At this point, it would be best to see if you can replicate the error. If so, write a bug report and see where it goes. I have always felt that the .32 kernels felt broken for some reason. This might be one of those breaks showing itself.

Cheers,
Pappy


the errors and weirdness have been happening all along, i just didn't think they'd show up in dmesg output. what i've experience is basically when there's a high load, things get messed up. i have emerges that would pause and i have to issue a control-z and then fg to get going again. browser issues and general sluggishness that comes up now and again.

i upgraded to .32-zen6 today, i'll see if the problem persists and i'll startt a new thread/bug report.

-=g=-
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've experienced sluggishness in getting from typed character on the keyboard to character showing up on the screen. With 2.6.33-zen1, that seems to not be an issue. It seems to be an issue for the .32. It might be worth a check to see how things work with the .33.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Pappy,

I can't figure out where to send you an email so I'm posting this here. I did look very carefully on www.kernel-seeds.org to see if you had an email address listed there but couldn't find one.

I was reading your write up regarding kernel seed settings. I had some comments which you might want to incorporate. Would you like me to post them here or send them in a private email? The comments are basically suggested clarifications.

I realise you're not yet commenting on further pages in the kernel settings, but towards that end, you may also want to peruse my "Tips and Tricks" post: If sound {sometimes} doesn't work - Things to check.

BTW, I did find much of your commentary to be helpful. I'll be further refining my kernel settings and posting the .config file in pastebin.com.

Thanks for all your great work and commentary.
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Moriah
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dufeu:

You can send Pappy a private message by clicking on the PM button at the bottom of one of his posts...
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moriah wrote:
dufeu:

You can send Pappy a private message by clicking on the PM button at the bottom of one of his posts...

DOH!!

I so rarely ever use that feature {read "virtually never"} that I completely forgot about it.

Thanks!

{edit} Message posted to Pappy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got the private message. I'll answer that.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

After eleven days of silence, at last, we have some signs of life from kernel.org. I've just uploaded the .configs for 2.6.32.10 and 2.6.33.1 in both x86 and x86_64 flavors. Enjoy!

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy-

just a quick update... still having page allocation failures using .32-zen6. it appears that 512 M of ram is just not enough for a desktop laptop these days. going to try .33-zen1 and .33-gentoo-r1 to see if that makes a difference.

-=g=-
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
After eleven days of silence, at last, we have some signs of life from kernel.org.


They can take some vacations too :P
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I certainly hope that 512 MB is enough because I have a number of machines that run now with 512 MB -- mostly firewalls, dhcp servers, etc. I am currently doing updates on these boxes, and because of recent udev changes, I need to upgrade the kernels in these boxes. If 512 MB is not enough anymore, then I am in big trouble! :o
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the vanilla-sources-2.6.33.1 .config file for my AMD64 based desktop sytem.

Includes KDE-4, Virtual Box and VMWare Workstation - all running fine. Other configuration information included in the above pastebin link.


This is the vanilla-sources-2.6.33 .config file for my Pentium III Mobile laptop.

Currently in the process of an extended "emerge -uND @world". {4 days and still running} Will include KDE-4, nvidia-drivers, VMWare-Workstation. Other configuration information included in the above pastebin link.


Enjoy!
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moriah wrote:
I certainly hope that 512 MB is enough because I have a number of machines that run now with 512 MB -- mostly firewalls, dhcp servers, etc. I am currently doing updates on these boxes, and because of recent udev changes, I need to upgrade the kernels in these boxes. If 512 MB is not enough anymore, then I am in big trouble! :o


i think 512 mb is plenty, just not for a desktop running a bunch of java based apps.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've wanted to try those seeds out for quite a while now, but I'm having problems getting them to work.
It seems to work pretty fine in general (meaning, it runs perfectly, daemons go up without a problem, I can SSH in, but it just doesn't detect my USB Keyboard and my USB mouse. It's the same issue when using Zen and the Normal Kernel Sources. However, if I use the default config with my additions it works perfectly.
I'm using the 2.6.33-zen1 Kernel and this config file.

Here are some of my specs:
Code:
xqyz@leicester ~ $ sudo lspci   
00:00.0 RAM memory: nVidia Corporation MCP55 Memory Controller (rev a2)
00:01.0 ISA bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP55 LPC Bridge (rev a3)
00:01.1 SMBus: nVidia Corporation MCP55 SMBus (rev a3)
00:02.0 USB Controller: nVidia Corporation MCP55 USB Controller (rev a1)
00:02.1 USB Controller: nVidia Corporation MCP55 USB Controller (rev a2)
00:04.0 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP55 IDE (rev a1)
00:05.0 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP55 SATA Controller (rev a3)
00:05.1 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP55 SATA Controller (rev a3)
00:05.2 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP55 SATA Controller (rev a3)
00:06.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP55 PCI bridge (rev a2)
00:06.1 Audio device: nVidia Corporation MCP55 High Definition Audio (rev a2)
00:08.0 Bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP55 Ethernet (rev a3)
00:0f.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP55 PCI Express bridge (rev a3)
00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] HyperTransport Technology Configuration
00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Address Map
00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] DRAM Controller
00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Miscellaneous Control
02:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation G92 [GeForce 9800 GT] (rev a2)
xqyz@leicester ~ $ sudo lspci -n
00:00.0 0500: 10de:0369 (rev a2)
00:01.0 0601: 10de:0360 (rev a3)
00:01.1 0c05: 10de:0368 (rev a3)
00:02.0 0c03: 10de:036c (rev a1)
00:02.1 0c03: 10de:036d (rev a2)
00:04.0 0101: 10de:036e (rev a1)
00:05.0 0101: 10de:037f (rev a3)
00:05.1 0101: 10de:037f (rev a3)
00:05.2 0101: 10de:037f (rev a3)
00:06.0 0604: 10de:0370 (rev a2)
00:06.1 0403: 10de:0371 (rev a2)
00:08.0 0680: 10de:0373 (rev a3)
00:0f.0 0604: 10de:0377 (rev a3)
00:18.0 0600: 1022:1100
00:18.1 0600: 1022:1101
00:18.2 0600: 1022:1102
00:18.3 0600: 1022:1103
02:00.0 0300: 10de:0614 (rev a2)


Code:
xqyz@leicester ~ $ sudo lsusb
Bus 002 Device 003: ID 046a:0011 Cherry GmbH G83 (RS 6000) Keyboard
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 045e:00cb Microsoft Corp.
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub


On the seeded kernel it's the same, minus the first two. I'm running n NForce 5 based Motherboard in case that's important, but that should be obvious from the output.

Anyone got any clues on how to solve it?
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

d2_racing wrote:
pappy_mcfae wrote:
After eleven days of silence, at last, we have some signs of life from kernel.org.


They can take some vacations too :P


Perhaps, but I've seen things die down like this before. I read it as taking the time to fix things that were broken when .33 went from rc status to released status. This is even truer when the sub-sources (gentoo, zen, tuxonice, etc.) aren't getting updated either.

Besides, when things die down in the kernel development world, things die down here as well. That's no good when I'm trying to get as many people to use my site as I can.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

geburns wrote:
pappy-

just a quick update... still having page allocation failures using .32-zen6. it appears that 512 M of ram is just not enough for a desktop laptop these days. going to try .33-zen1 and .33-gentoo-r1 to see if that makes a difference.

-=g=-


As others have said, that depends on what you're doing with the machine. I ran an old P-III lappy with 256 Megs. All it did was store distfiles, so 256 megs never got challenged except for emerging, which the little machine did quite well, albeit slowly.

I also have two machines running with 512 even now. Neither machine have shown a propensity to do this, although one does get weird about shutting down properly if it's been up for weeks on end. Since that issue has left since I moved the guts to a better case, I have to believe that the crappy case was causing spurious signal errors because it didn't hold the video card into the mobo tightly enough.

I'm thinking either there is a problem with that kernel and how it reacts to your machine, or there is a problem with one of the memory sticks, or something else hardware related. Considering how laptops are put together, it is not out of the realm of possibility that there are likely some loose connections, and heat and longer running times can sometimes conspire to give you the errors you have.

I'd try different RAM, or use half the memory and see if the issue remains. I'd also see how it runs under Windoze, as in is Windoze really unstable or weird while running on the same machine? If so, then it is a hardware issue, either connection or mobo-based. If not, then it is a strange kernel issue.

Hope that gives you a few more ideas.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dufeu,

Just checking to see if you have kernel issues, or if you're sharing.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

XQYZ,

Yes. Post your current .config for the machine in question, as well as it's /etc/fstab file. I believe you have everything else listed I'll need to set you up a decent kernel.

Cheers,
Pappy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pappy_mcfae wrote:
Yes. Post your current .config for the machine in question, as well as it's /etc/fstab file. I believe you have everything else listed I'll need to set you up a decent kernel.


Ok, here's the config for a standard gentoo-sources kernel which I'm currently running without any issues: link
My fstab (using ext4 mostly): link
My attempt to configure a zen-sources using your seed: link
An older attempt (2.6.31) using gentoo-sources with your seed: link

Both my attempts work perfectly, but do not detect my USB Keyboard + Mouse.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your system uses OHCI USB drivers, not UHCI. That change should get the USB stuff working. I also gave your kernels a tweak with the latest experimental settings. See how that works out for you.

Gentoo-sources
Zen-sources

Post /var/log/dmesg from both so I can see how things loaded.

Cheers,
Pappy
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