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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:09 pm    Post subject: [SOLVED] Installing without ethernet Reply with quote

Hi, a wannabe Gentoo-user tried to install Gentoo, but failed miserably.

Is there any easier way than manually configuring everything?
I'm coming from Debian-family (Debiam, Ubuntu, Mint), and things seem quite different in Gentoo.

My machine is HP Pavilion a6622sc, and the only network connection is wifi (Realtek RTL8201Ni).
The processor is phenom 3X (8550, amdfam10) and the graphics is NVIDIA GeForce 6150SE.

Maybe a boot CD/DVD I could copy the 64-bit kernel from?

Or maybe someone knows the root password for the amd64-LiveDVD 20121221?


Last edited by turboscrew on Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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cwr
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need some sort of internet connection to download the sources, though I used to do
installs entirely via sneakernet (and some shell scripts I wrote to help out).

You can install Gentoo via any Linux that will boot on your system; people often use the
SystemRescue CD, for instance. Once you've got an internet connection, just follow the
handbook.

Will
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turboscrew,

The root password for the amd64-LiveDVD 20121221 is scrambled every boot but you don't need it

Open a terminal window and enter
Code:
sudo su -

You be root in that terminal. You can now set the root password if you wish.
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Running gparted (or was it parted?) didn't work. It still wanted the root password.
I wanted to use it, because it shows the partitions more intuitive way than fdisk.

The downside of the rescue disk (for genkernel) was that it is 32-bit whereas I wanted to install for amd64.
At least that's what I understood.

The minimal install CD didn't support my wifi (my only network connection).
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ShanaXXII
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turboscrew wrote:
The minimal install CD didn't support my wifi (my only network connection).

See if this helps ->> http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Wifi
turboscrew wrote:
Running gparted (or was it parted?) didn't work. It still wanted the root password.
I wanted to use it, because it shows the partitions more intuitive way than fdisk.

are u using the gentoo minimal install cd for this? if you are, i dont think there should be a root password.
you should be able to create a password by
Code:
# passwd
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cwr
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need a 64-bit CD to install a 64-bit Gentoo (there might be a way around that, but it would be tricky).
However, any 64-bit Linux that you can boot from DVD or USB will do.

If you want to run gparted then use sudo on the command line to become root, then run gparted from
the command prompt.

Will
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@CWT: I think some other distro's kernel may not be compatible with Gentoo for genkernel.
I also think that manual kernel configuration by first-timer installer is quite hard and time-consuming.
Especially when my only network connection is wi-fi, and graphics is nvidia.
Tried that once and failed (plus now my left shoulder hurts - probably sat too long in lfront of the keyboard). :-)

How about older LiveDVDs? maybe there is some older one that doesn't have a root password, or the root password is known?
That could then be updated? (Or should I say upgraded?)

[edit]
Just realized, there is a Gentoo on amd64 section.
Should this thread be here or there?
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gerard27
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turboscrew,
You should have taken cwr's advice.
Resuecd is the non-plus-ultra live CD for installing Gentoo.
Read my sig,
Gerard.
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To install Gentoo I use sysrescuecd.Based on Gentoo,has firefox to browse Gentoo docs and mc to browse (and edit) files.
The same disk can be used for 32 and 64 bit installs.
You can follow the Handbook verbatim.
http://www.sysresccd.org/Download
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@gerard82: That's with what I failed...
Minimal didn't support my wifi and LiveCD didn't let me use parted (or was it gparted) without root password. I thought there might have been other similar situation too later,
and I hated the idea of possibly stumbling into that after several hours of kernel configuration.

I've been thinking, maybe it would be better for me to first set up the system somehow (=genkernel) and then update/upgrade.
Maybe I try the root password advice when I get home from work.
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creaker
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since you are Debian/Mint user, obviously you should be familiar with Mint Live DVD. It has a good enough support for wifi cards. Probably it will be suitable for your hardware. Put iso to the stick (withh dd) if you have no ready to use live DVD and try it out.
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khayyam
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

creaker, gerard82 ... déjà vu

@turboscrew ... if you are having issues configuring your kernel then you should state what it is exactly you're having problems with, copying a kernel and modules from some other source is possible, but generally we don't do this as the whole point of doing it "manually" is so that you get exactly whats wanted (and not what some developer decided everyone needs). That's the raison d'être behind using gentoo. That may be difficult if you're unfamiliar with how to go about things ... but thats why the community exists ... its just a matter of asking the right questions :)

best ... khay
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Cyker
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, the kernel configuration is much harder and time consuming compared to when I started (2.4 days?). You could easily spend a couple of days researching and going through the kernel options to understand which ones you need and what they do now!

There's guy here called Pappy who created 'kernel seeds', which are pre-configured base-line kernels; I don't know if he still is, but if so they'd be a good place to start!
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gerard27
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you at least consult the Gentoo Handbook?
I get the impression you haven't!
Genkernel is in there so what's the trouble?
If you use rescuecd and fire up firefox you can read the handbook and do the install.
Gerard.
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To install Gentoo I use sysrescuecd.Based on Gentoo,has firefox to browse Gentoo docs and mc to browse (and edit) files.
The same disk can be used for 32 and 64 bit installs.
You can follow the Handbook verbatim.
http://www.sysresccd.org/Download
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cwr
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerard82 - thanks for the note on SystemRescueCD - I wasn't sure that it actually handled 32 _and_ 64 bits.
Now there's no real reason to look elsewhere.

Will
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all: amd64 LiveDVD :
Code:
Gentoo-2012 ~ # partitionmanager
which: no hal-lock in (/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/opt/bin:/usr/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/gcc-bin/4.5.3)
partitionmanager-bin: cannot connect to X server
Gentoo-2012 ~ # gparted

(gpartedbin:22737): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display:
Gentoo-2012 ~ #
Gentoo-2012 ~ # export DISPLAY=localhost:0.0
Gentoo-2012 ~ # gparted
No protocol specified

(gpartedbin:22783): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: localhost:0.0
Gentoo-2012 ~ # logout
gentoo@Gentoo-2012 ~ $ sudo gparted
No protocol specified
No protocol specified

(gpartedbin:22834): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: :0
gentoo@Gentoo-2012 ~ $ sudo partitionmanager
which: no hal-lock in (/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/opt/bin)
No protocol specified
No protocol specified
partitionmanager-bin: cannot connect to X server :0


@gerard82: I was using the rescueCD and tried to do by the Gentoo amd64-manual + wiki/Installation_alternatives 3. Installation from non-Gentoo LiveCDs.

@khayyam: My thought was (after an about 12 hr try -> failure) to do genkernel first and then later update/upgrade in suitable "chunks". Now I have too many "special cases" to deal with at once, like no ethernet, but wi-fi only and nvidia graphics in addition to half of the kernel features I know nothing about plus serious shortage of time.

@creaker: HW is suitable for at least Debian Etch (except the wifi - had to get it manually), Mint 13 and ubuntu 14.01, all been run for quite some time (well, before Ubuntu 14.04 there was Ubunty 12.04). They all have not-so-optimal support for embedded programming (as tool, not target).

I get the feeling, that setting up Gentoo by a Gentoo-noobie takes usually more than 2 days?
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creaker
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turboscrew wrote:
HW is suitable for at least Debian Etch (except the wifi - had to get it manually), Mint 13 and ubuntu 14.01, all been run for quite some time
.

If so, you can use Debian/Mint/Ubuntu kernel as a base point for your Gentoo's kernel. I think the best option is the latest one (in terms of kernel version). Just extract config from existing Debian/Mint/Ubuntu kernel and save it into /usr/src/linux/ as ".config".
Run "make && make modules_install", if some "Gentoo-related" options are missed, you will be asked for these options during build.
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@creaker: Sounds like a very good idea. :D
Thanks!

I obviously have to take a more "zen" attitude also.

[edit]
Mageia 4.1 seems to have the same kernel that I've been seeing: 3.12.21


Last edited by turboscrew on Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gerard27
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@cwr,my pleasure.

@turboscrew,the code you showed is from the live cd,not rescuecd.
If you use rescuecd you won't have any problems with root passwd etc.
You just follow the handbook and when it comes to compiling your kernel use genkernel.
After all before you can compile a kernel you need the infrastructure from the stage that has to be installed first.
You have gotten used to point and click installs that give you a working system in no time.
Gentoo is NOT like that.
Gerard.
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To install Gentoo I use sysrescuecd.Based on Gentoo,has firefox to browse Gentoo docs and mc to browse (and edit) files.
The same disk can be used for 32 and 64 bit installs.
You can follow the Handbook verbatim.
http://www.sysresccd.org/Download
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@gerard82: Not with the root password, but with the wifi.
Quote:
when it comes to compiling your kernel use genkernel

That I was a bit worried about if I had x86 kernel (rescueCD) and amd64 stage3.

Quote:
Gentoo is NOT like that.

Neither was RedHat 3.0.3 (my first Linux), but during the last decade, I must admit, I've grown
accustomed to expect something like that.
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cwr
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't understand why the Gentoo 2012 can't find the X server display. Did you actually boot
to a desktop?

If you boot a 64-bit kernel from SystemRescueCD you could use the /proc/config.gz output
(if it exists on that kernel) as a starting point for the genkernel build.

Will
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gerard27
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you dyslectic?
Rescuecd can be started as x86 OR x86_64 (also known as amd64)!
It's in my sig,read it!
And read what's on the website of sysrescue.
Make your wifi work first on the rescuecd.
Gerard.
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To install Gentoo I use sysrescuecd.Based on Gentoo,has firefox to browse Gentoo docs and mc to browse (and edit) files.
The same disk can be used for 32 and 64 bit installs.
You can follow the Handbook verbatim.
http://www.sysresccd.org/Download
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I read on the page is:

Quote:
Download final stable version for i586/amd64 (default choice)
Stable x86: SystemRescueCd-x86-4.3.0 (388 MiB)


I understood that this is x86 systen meant for both x86 and x86_64.
(x86_64 runs x86 instruction subset)
So it has 32-bit kernel that can be run on 64-bit iron as well?

Why I'd like to have 64-bit: for example for qemu.

[edit]
Ah, now I understand - it has 64-bit kernels included too.
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NeddySeagoon
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turboscrew,

System Rescue CD has a selection of kernels. The default is 32 bit. You need to choose a 64 bit kernel when you boot System Rescue CD.
Its on the very first menu screen.
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turboscrew
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I extracted the stuff from Mageia 4.1, but I'm not sure it's a good idea to use its kernel config, or /etc/modules.
It didn't feel very stable: I had 2 mouses attached (temporarily). In first boot neither worked.
In the second boot both worked, but I managed to get stuck -> 3rd reboot, one mouse worked, and the second too after
unplugging and the re-plugging it.

There were also messages about wrong USB host driver lOHCI UHCI EHCI) loading orders in the dmesg.

Just hinting other people who may have thought about that.

Maybe I'll use some other distro's - like Mint's - stuff for reference...

[edit]
Oh, and this might be useful for gentoo-wannabes like me: http://oreilly.com/linux/excerpts/9780596100797/kernel-configuration-option-reference.html
Here is the whole thing: http://www.kroah.com/lkn/

It's probably in the wiki somewhere, but didn't find it there.
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cwr
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can use any kernel config from /proc/config.gz (the SystemRescue CD config would be a good starting point).
I wouldn't advise using modules from another kernel; just compile gentoo-sources yourself.

Will
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